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I have noticed that some people are posting stock (purchased) tracks for collaboration. The crazy part is that they probably haven't even actually purchased the track yet because the audio stinger is still in the track! They are requesting vocals and lyrics. I am not asking that anything be done about it. I am just appalled that people think they can come here, post (allegedly) purchased tracks, and call it a collaboration!

As musicians, we create in many different ways. Some of us only play instruments. Some of us use loops and beats. Some of us use a combination. But for someone to just upload a stock track and ask for lyrics and vocals seems a bit disingenuous with respect to a collaboration unless they at least already have some lyrics and vocals attached to it. It seems like they are just trying to get some "free" lyric/vocal work done by the very talented musicians on this site! It's like saying, "Here. Write some lyrics and melody to this track that I, myself, didn't write and if it is good enough, we will call it a collaboration. I might actually purchase the track from the "real" owner and maybe we can see where it goes from there.

I certainly don't expect all/any of my collabs to go any farther than this site. If they do, then great. If they don't then, okay. But people coming here and asking the very talented musicians here to write to stock tracks just seems a bit of an afront to me. Sorry if this seems like a rant. It just caught me in the gut. 

#4859 Posted Fri 10 Jun, 2022 8:21 pm

I have noticed that some people are posting stock (purchased) tracks for collaboration. The crazy part is that they probably haven't even actually purchased the track yet because the audio stinger is still in the track! They are requesting vocals and lyrics. I am not asking that anything be done about it. I am just appalled that people think they can come here, post (allegedly) purchased tracks, and call it a collaboration!

As musicians, we create in many different ways. Some of us only play instruments. Some of us use loops and beats. Some of us use a combination. But for someone to just upload a stock track and ask for lyrics and vocals seems a bit disingenuous with respect to a collaboration unless they at least already have some lyrics and vocals attached to it. It seems like they are just trying to get some "free" lyric/vocal work done by the very talented musicians on this site! It's like saying, "Here. Write some lyrics and melody to this track that I, myself, didn't write and if it is good enough, we will call it a collaboration. I might actually purchase the track from the "real" owner and maybe we can see where it goes from there.

I certainly don't expect all/any of my collabs to go any farther than this site. If they do, then great. If they don't then, okay. But people coming here and asking the very talented musicians here to write to stock tracks just seems a bit of an afront to me. Sorry if this seems like a rant. It just caught me in the gut. 

Originally posted by kimberh on Fri 10 Jun, 2022

I think you have a point here, I would feel the same.

I think it is required to identify loops and other possibly copyrighted material that you didn't make yourself or possibly own, before you upload. Pretty sure the project should identify this so if it did not then possibly that is a breech of the sites rules.

It's so hard to tell now days how something is created other than if it sounds too good then maybe it's not original. Then you might miss out on great songs though if you apply that test always.

My advice is to sit back and observe, a creator of real content will usually want to work with others. They will jump on projects they didn't create, offering skills that aren't so easily done as when you start your own project with material you didn't create. If others join their projects you'll soon see how genuine they are. To me it's an instant red flag when someone joins a collaboration site and only uploads projects and doesn't join them. I might like the song and join in but I'm aware there may be a risk I'm taking. So if I do then I take the approach mentally that if it works out fine, if not I get a nice afternoon creating. The key is not to get too invested when you see this, keep your expectations low and just enjoy the time creating.

#4860 Posted Sat 11 Jun, 2022 2:45 am

I think you have a point here, I would feel the same.

I think it is required to identify loops and other possibly copyrighted material that you didn't make yourself or possibly own, before you upload. Pretty sure the project should identify this so if it did not then possibly that is a breech of the sites rules.

It's so hard to tell now days how something is created other than if it sounds too good then maybe it's not original. Then you might miss out on great songs though if you apply that test always.

My advice is to sit back and observe, a creator of real content will usually want to work with others. They will jump on projects they didn't create, offering skills that aren't so easily done as when you start your own project with material you didn't create. If others join their projects you'll soon see how genuine they are. To me it's an instant red flag when someone joins a collaboration site and only uploads projects and doesn't join them. I might like the song and join in but I'm aware there may be a risk I'm taking. So if I do then I take the approach mentally that if it works out fine, if not I get a nice afternoon creating. The key is not to get too invested when you see this, keep your expectations low and just enjoy the time creating.

Originally posted by GoodVibes on Sat 11 Jun, 2022

That's excellent advice!

#4861 Posted Sat 11 Jun, 2022 8:35 am
Thanks for taking time to make ppl aware of this.
#4862 Posted Sat 11 Jun, 2022 8:39 am

Please identify the supposed stock tracks you are complaining about? Some of us use lots of loops and samples in our music. I use a ton. Some of my own, some purchased and some freebies. In fact, some of us make a living creating and selling sample packs.. Samples are nothing new, and I encourage their use in song creation.

#4863 Posted Sat 11 Jun, 2022 1:59 pm

Please identify the supposed stock tracks you are complaining about? Some of us use lots of loops and samples in our music. I use a ton. Some of my own, some purchased and some freebies. In fact, some of us make a living creating and selling sample packs.. Samples are nothing new, and I encourage their use in song creation.

Originally posted by B4dRandle on Sat 11 Jun, 2022

Looks like the user took the track down. I use Output Arcade and Splice as well as arps and generated beats in the software I own. These are legal loops and I have no problem with them. Music is the art of structured sound after all. My problem with this user was that the track had audio stingers that repeated throughout the track. I can't remember exactly what they were, but if you've ever been to sites like Beatstars, they often protect their tracks by using a random, repetative stinger throughout that identifies where the track came from.

I too am a supporter of loops. Suggesting that people should not use them is like saying that people should not use MIDI. No problem with loops and beats at all! But I just thought that someone posting a track with audio stingers and nothing else, then requesting lyrics and melody seemed a bit shady. Perhaps my perspective is skewed. Just felt it was worth discussing.

#4864 Posted Sat 11 Jun, 2022 5:48 pm

Looks like the user took the track down. I use Output Arcade and Splice as well as arps and generated beats in the software I own. These are legal loops and I have no problem with them. Music is the art of structured sound after all. My problem with this user was that the track had audio stingers that repeated throughout the track. I can't remember exactly what they were, but if you've ever been to sites like Beatstars, they often protect their tracks by using a random, repetative stinger throughout that identifies where the track came from.

I too am a supporter of loops. Suggesting that people should not use them is like saying that people should not use MIDI. No problem with loops and beats at all! But I just thought that someone posting a track with audio stingers and nothing else, then requesting lyrics and melody seemed a bit shady. Perhaps my perspective is skewed. Just felt it was worth discussing.

Originally posted by kimberh on Sat 11 Jun, 2022

Ahhh, I see..  Someone posted a complete stock song with the watermarks (stingers) in place.. yeah, I could see how that might seem shady.

Some beat producers are ultra paranoid about getting ripped off and will put these watermarks, stingers, beat tags or whatever you prefer to call them over their song to keep them from being stolen and used basically like karaoke for a singer to claim as their own tune.  I can see their point.. After spending hundreds of hours mixing and creating a complete song, I would hate for someone to steal it. Sometimes I like to mix in some vocals from a sample pack over my song just for this type of protection until I can find a vocalist to work with.

Thanks for bringing this up.. Yes, it very well is worth disussing. 

#4865 Posted Sat 11 Jun, 2022 6:18 pm

I have noticed that some people are posting stock (purchased) tracks for collaboration. The crazy part is that they probably haven't even actually purchased the track yet because the audio stinger is still in the track! They are requesting vocals and lyrics. I am not asking that anything be done about it. I am just appalled that people think they can come here, post (allegedly) purchased tracks, and call it a collaboration!

As musicians, we create in many different ways. Some of us only play instruments. Some of us use loops and beats. Some of us use a combination. But for someone to just upload a stock track and ask for lyrics and vocals seems a bit disingenuous with respect to a collaboration unless they at least already have some lyrics and vocals attached to it. It seems like they are just trying to get some "free" lyric/vocal work done by the very talented musicians on this site! It's like saying, "Here. Write some lyrics and melody to this track that I, myself, didn't write and if it is good enough, we will call it a collaboration. I might actually purchase the track from the "real" owner and maybe we can see where it goes from there.

I certainly don't expect all/any of my collabs to go any farther than this site. If they do, then great. If they don't then, okay. But people coming here and asking the very talented musicians here to write to stock tracks just seems a bit of an afront to me. Sorry if this seems like a rant. It just caught me in the gut. 

Originally posted by kimberh on Fri 10 Jun, 2022

Hi Kimber, thanks so much for bringing this to our attention. Unfortunately, we don't get around to listening to every single project that gets posted to the site, so you bringing awareness to this situation is greatly appreciated.

As Andrew mentioned, it is in our Terms of Service that members who start a project and upload tracks, must have permission to do so by the actual creator of the track. Unless, of course, it is the member's own material.

I did find the project in question - and although the member did state (in the project's description) that they did not purchase the stock track "yet", it is still against the TOS for them to upload material that is not theirs without the creators permission.

We did send that member a PM asking them to either purchase the license for the track or to please remove the project. The member was kind & very quick to respond, and said they would indeed purchase the license, then re-upload the project once they do.

Joining and being a part of a music collaboration site can be quite the learning curve for many, so we always try to educate members as best we can. I'm hoping that this forum post can help someone if they ever find themselves in a similar situation.

Just an FYI, If anyone reading this is wondering how to give proper credit - it is very simple. When you start a project, you'll see there is a 'Credits' section. There you can give credit to any member or non-member. There is a place for their name & url that links to their original work.

Thank you again, Kimber.  :)

#4866 Posted Sat 11 Jun, 2022 7:13 pm
Nothing new. I'm surprised it took so long here. I remember on another site a guy posted Old Time Rock'n Roll by Bob Seger. Like no one would notice lol
#4867 Posted Wed 15 Jun, 2022 1:05 am
Hey guys, don't take this so seriously. That's how it's been going for decades, also in the professional branch. Otherwise "Puff Daddy" would not have had a hit with "Come with me", for example. Or a whole lot of hits in the dance scene would never came out. That's the way it is. Do your own projects and don't bother with that. Personally, I find it interesting what emerges from such projects. :-)
#4868 Posted Wed 15 Jun, 2022 9:51 am
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